Also known as the M88 Mauser, Gew 88, Kar88, and Gewehr 88.
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Plevna |
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C96Guy -- Once again I am indebted to your keen eyes! Thank you much! I also received your private message and have added those markings to
the slowly expanding lists of regimental markings and serial numbers.
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Doug Strong.britishmilitari... |
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I should list mine:
Lowe 401d 1891 Spandau 3512c 1895 Spandau 6306v 1890 Spandau 2017d Year Unclear Maker unclear 3679d? Year Unclear |
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Plevna |
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Doug: Thank you much for contributing your serial numbers to the ongoing study. Intriguingly, of the several hundred Gew 88 serial numbers
recorded thus far, 1895 Spandaus are rather far and few between. Of the 10 rifles for this year, the highest serial to date is 9389l (L).
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butler |
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A couple more
Spandau 1890 S 781t Lowe Berlin 1891 S 325a |
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Plevna |
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butler: Thank you kindly! These have been duely noted and all numbers are greatly appreciated!
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C96Guy |
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PLEVNA
Have any of the serial numbers furnished after you compiled your production numbers, changed or significantly altered you previous conclusions? ie.. new serial number increases production number of Spandau rifles in 1895 ?? |
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Plevna |
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C96Guy: Great question! I have not yet done an arsenal by arsenal and year by year comparison of the previous compilation with the list
I've been working on this past year so I cannot provide any precise figures at this time. One thing that has jumped up at me is finding a clear photograph
of an 1899 (!) Amberg Gew 88 showing how late this model was produced at that arsenal. I also recall seeing a couple of additional "high" numbers
from other arsenals. All in all, I think the previous aggregate production figure will increase slightly (perhaps by 100,000 rifles) but that is purely a guess
at this time and subject to change.
Not surprisingly, accumulating serial numbers is a slow and all too often "hit or miss" proposition. Some arsenals and years are well represented whereas others show up much less frequently -- if at all. A working assumption in this effort is that all rifles were sequentially numbered at each arsenal in each production year which further presumes that all (or at least many) lower case suffixes should be present in a large enough sample. I'm not necessarily convinced that this is the case when glancing at a very small number of Kar 88 and Gew 91 serial numbers I have separately collected. For example, one forum member kindly reported to me an 1893 Erfurt Kar 88 with serial number 6911g which makes me wonder if these were separately serial numbered or -- importantly -- were built on receivers pulled out of the Gew 88 parts bins. Saying that the carbines were "few in number" is rather vague and I have not seen any "authoritative" statements on exactly how many of these were produced at facilities completely removed from Haenel and Schilling. Another "monkey wrench in the gearbox of progress" in determining total Gew 88 production is that some collectors have noted that the Germans did NOT use both "i" and "j" suffixes on their rifles (hence a full year's production to the end of the "z" series of numbers would be 10,000 less rifles). While I can say for a fact that both "i" and "j" suffixes have been reported to me, I obviously cannot verify that those folks who reported these correctly read the Fraktur lettering (which admittedly can seem like a very strange language to those of us accustomed to Latin letters). One could literally spend years trying to accumulate an ever larger sample of numbers and still end up with a relatively small universe of serial numbers in light of so many of these rifles having been destroyed or otherwise scattered who knows where through the years. While I would certainly like to have a broader (and, hopefully, firmer) basis for reporting on Gew 88 production, there comes a point of ever diminishing returns on how many numbers are available for inspection and/or reported. So to address your question, I'm currently trying to "fill in some blanks" regarding the range of serial numbers used in each production year (and there is no lack of such blanks) and hope that I will be in the position next year to prepare an update to the previous study. As much as we might like to have access to a truly comprehensive data base, the realities of life indicate that this is an unattainable goal and sometimes the best we can do is to work within the limitations of the information we have. |
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C96Guy |
Lets expand our search internationally | ||
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Plevna,
I agreee that eventually we'll reach a point of diminishing returns, having said that I believe these rifles will continue to suface at auctions, estate sales and the backs of closets. I think the way to really obtain the data needed to fill in the gaps and that elusive 1897 chamber date is to expand internationally. I will contact my shooting and collecting friends in Danmark and ask them to furnish the data on their 1888 rifles, ( Arsenal Name and Date as well as serial number and unit markings) and to post a request for data on their shooting / reloading forums. I feel that there were 3.5 million rifles made and by asking our shooting and collecting brothers overseas to help, we can kick it up a notch If anyone has a foriegn contact please feel free to seek their assistance,by posting the request on their forums. WE have made great strides in understanding the history of this beautiful rifle. Many hands make for light work ! God Bless ya'll C96 Guy Possi |
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Plevna |
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C96Guy: Giving it the old college try, expanding contacts here and abroad certainly can't hurt! Any and all input would be greatly
appreciated and I think it's worth a go. At a bare minimum, Old Western Scrounger imported 15,000 of these from Ecuador -- and where did all of these go?
Discounting those which were parted out, there surely must have been several hundred (or thousand) which were rebuilt and I have not recorded anywhere near
that many serial numbers.
It is entirely possible that you are correct in your estimate of 3,500,000 total Gew 88 production. In general terms, most of this production was assigned to Imperial German troops (both active and reserve) but another sizable quantity was sold abroad as new production (I'll discount for the moment subsequent German surplus sales) by Steyr. If even one out of twenty of these 3,500,000 rifles has survived, there should be a suffient broad-based sample to allow marked improvement in estimating Gew 88 production. No one of us can hope to single-handed accumulate this mass of information and the process necessitates lots of collectors merging the information they have. This may require accumulating one number at a time but it can be done -- and all of us will be better informed as a result. |
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